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LEAD Lathe

Discussion in 'CNC Lathes' started by Giarc, Jun 14, 2020.

  1. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Giarc published a new build:

    Read more about this build...
     
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  2. Alex Chambers

    Alex Chambers Master
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    Following this with interest as it's something I would very much like to do.
    (The Ebay link for the rotary axis has died though @Giarc).
    I know you wanted to use only Openbuilds parts, but I think a sheet metal brace behind the uprights would be a bit more rigid.
    Alex.
     
  3. Rick 2.0

    Rick 2.0 OpenBuilds Team
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    Nice design. Two items you might look into. The drive rail on the X-axis should be the lower rail. This creates less eccentricity on the system and thus less flexure when you're milling lengthwise. The other would be lengthwise adjustability of the tail stock. Jon Norris had a pretty good approach in his design but it won't quite give you the depth you seek. You might consider using a 20x40 rail centered on the bottom rail and an inverted C-Beam as the lower block on the tail stock stack to allow for a self aligning slide.
     
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  4. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Very cool looking design @Giarc following this one!
     
  5. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Here are the two Lathes that I am stealing ideas from. Rotary CNC and C Beam Rotary I believe Gwandad's is done, but he just did not mark it as such. I had also considered doing like Gwandad did in his and use a 40*3*1000 mm piece of aluminum bar stock as a guide for the tailstock, but living in the U.S. may make that difficult since most places around me that sell aluminum only have 1 1/2" inch (38.1mm).

    I had considered using aluminum plates on the outside edges of my stack of smaller 2080s that would hold them all together and over lap the 1000mm long 2080 "guide". It would get locked in place with the t-slot bolts.

    Alex, this is the ebay seller that I purchased from. They have an Amazon store. I wanted a 4 Jaw when I first ordered, but it was not available. Now it is. :rolleyes: No big deal. I have a solution for round stock. I linked both below. I have the 3 jaw. The same seller (RATTM) has an Ebay store which has lower prices.
    https://www.amazon.com/K11-100mm-Engraving-Rotational-Tailstock-Reducing/dp/B07B2RTBGZ/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=cnc+router+4th+axis+100mm+3+jaw+chuck&tailstock&qid=1592164546&s=industrial&sr=1-3

    https://www.amazon.com/K12-100mm-Milling-Rotational-Tailstock-Reducing/dp/B07B2RX1BK/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=cnc+router+4th+axis+100mm+3+jaw+chuck&tailstock&qid=1592164605&s=industrial&sr=1-2

    Also, I may switch to an aluminum plate as a brace because I have a lot of it due to buying things without thinking through a design all the way. :rolleyes: For the home builder without a CNC, it would be as simple as buying a piece of dimensional aluminum and putting a .pdf template I will provide over the top as a hole drilling guide. Hey, if I can hand build an entire CNC router that way, it should be simple to drill two lines of holes at 90 degrees. :)

    I already have a base cabinet for it. My dad had an oak china cabinet base that has sat unfinished for 30 years in storage. It is a shame to use it for a shop cabinet, but I have no other use for it and it has a lot of drawers for storage.
     
    #5 Giarc, Jun 14, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2020
  6. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I will make the switch in the design. Thanks.
     
  7. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I forgot to mention, I plan to add a laser diode to this as well, since I have one from an Acro build which got switched over to modifying a CO2 laser.
     
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  8. JustinTime

    JustinTime Journeyman
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    Craig, could you not use two 40mm shims (the 2 bottom ones) and one 80mm on the tail stock instead of the three 80mm and than you'll have the option of bolting them to the 80mm frame part?
     
  9. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I am not quite sure I understand what you mean.

    Last night, I realized that this whole thing could be done with two High Z mods, a set of Cbeam end plates and a few pieces of extrusion and a few other items. The parts list should be simple to compile when I get to it.
     
  10. Rick 2.0

    Rick 2.0 OpenBuilds Team
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    I don't think the High-Z mod kit includes any of the drive parts so you'll still be a fair distance out with the two High-Z kits. I would probably break it down into a couple actuator kits ([email protected], [email protected]) and 4 additional gantry kits, adding in a bag of long screws and a bag of 9mm spacers to turn the gantry carts into the front/back design. Beyond that, add in 1m of C-beam, a stack of regular V-slot and a whole lot of connectors to round out the design.
     
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  11. JustinTime

    JustinTime Journeyman
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    Attached Files:

  12. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    August 8:
    I finally got more time to work on this in the evenings this week. The first thing I did was assemble two sets of extra wide Cbeam Gantry plates as per the OpenBuilds LEAD video instructions and using the OpenBuilds components listed in the video. Upon doing this I realized that since I want 8 wheels guiding my Z axis up and down for extra rigidity (I hope) I would need a plate to tie these two plates together. I came up with a solution that turned out to be overly complicated, so a solution to my solution was found :thumbsup:. Basically I used my CNC router to mill an 8 holed plate that would incorporate the 4 axle screws and existing threaded holes on the gantry plates. This goes against my goal of no custom plates, but this could easily be cut and drilled by hand out of aluminum or plywood, or 3D printed. The other option is to mount it just like the High Z mod for the LEAD where the Cbeam holds the plates together with a moving Gantry cart carrying the spindle. I may choose to ultimately go that route but for now I will try this method first. If someone else chooses to do this build, I can make the plates I came up with for them or just provide the file and they can cut it themselves.
    DSC_0028.JPG

    Then I realized I would need longer axle screws and would have to disassemble everything. Therefore, I just drilled out the two holes where the axles could poke through with a step bit. I gave it a nice coat of Navy Blue to see if I like the color. I do, but I think sticking with all black would look better.
    DSC_0030.JPG

    Prior to tightening up the screws holding this on the gantry plates, I put both gantry carts on the Cbeams for the X axis and inserted the 500mm z axis Cbeam and tightened all the eccentrics on the wheels. Then I squared it all up and tightened the joiner plate.

    DSC_0039.JPG
    DSC_0040.JPG
     
    #12 Giarc, Aug 8, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2020
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  13. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    August 9:
    A little further progress. I realized I forgot to order the 90 Degree Joining Plate so I made my own slightly narrower plates because I had a narrower scrap piece of 6.5 mm aluminum. I like the way they look, and it got rid of aluminum that I otherwise had no use for at the moment. But the 90 degree joining plates would absolutely work for this, after all they are used in the LEAD build.

    DSC_0042.JPG
    I then mounted the uprights to the two C-Beam® Linear Rails, put on the C-Beam® End Mount using four 25mm Low Profile Screws per end mount. I also installed the 8mm Metric Acme Lead Screw, shaft collars, 8mm washer, and 8mm bearing as per the LEAD instructional video. Ignore the Covid-19 hoarding of Crunchberries and Froot Loops by my 14 year old in the background of the picture. Priorities! Also, the lathe build is resting on the rear of my existing CNC which is why there are other plates and extrusions on the bottom of the photo.
    upload_2020-8-10_20-23-44.png
    However, my C-Beams are mounted on the front of the uprights rather than the rear in the other builds. This lead to some concerns with the lock collar set screw. When originally put on and tightened down (not all the way) it would hit the upright 500 mm 2080 V slot when the lead screw rotated.
    DSC_0045a.JPG
    After debating how I would solve it, I just tightened them down as hard as I safely could with an electric screwdriver and the problem solved itself. I also added additional corner brackets using 8mm low profile screws and Drop In Tee Nuts where I couldn't use the Tee Nuts - M5 (10 Pack).

    I had purchased this spindle mount from ebay (I wish OB sold a 65 mm mount ;) ):
    DSC_0060.JPG

    Unfortunately for me, I did not see the four large M6 socket cap screws protruding 6 mm out the back, or it would have been an easy mount to the z axis C-beam. Back to Fusion 360 for a custom plate from 6.5mm aluminum.
    upload_2020-8-10_20-39-17.png
    I milled it real quick, but had an oopsie! Remember to make sure that end mill is tightened down real well in the collet :banghead:.
    DSC_0058.JPG
    Ah well. It is fully functional, but upside down in the picture which is why the holes do not line up on the bottom.:) I do need to clean up these newly milled plates, the scrap piece I cut them out of was really dirty, but cheap since it was scrap.
    DSC_0064.JPG
    Now it is time to start assembling the Blackbox (Ghost Version).
     
    #13 Giarc, Aug 10, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2020
  14. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Not much done this weekend, but I finally got the Black Box I received well over a year ago together! I am a bit behind schedule I guess. :)
    IMG_20200823_193035429_2.jpg
     
  15. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Wow! Time has flown by and I have not got much done since the last post. So, as of today (September 25):

    I attached the spindle mount to the plate and made sure the plate was square to the c-beam using some 1-2-3 blocks. You can also see the sheet metal shim (leftover flashing) I needed since my Fake-ita (Harbor Freight Version) was just a hair too small for the spindle mount. I choose the Bauer router because it uses all the same parts (collets, brushes, etc...) as the Makita I have on my CNC router at nearly half the price (on sale). I figure it is the same quality as the other knock-offs that other hobby CNC companies sell under their brand name, so why not give it a shot.
    DSC_0096.JPG
    I also added the NEMA 23 high torque stepper motors. These will only be on here until I rebuild my old CNC router and then I will swap those motors over to this one. I like to add a "real" screw rather than a grub screw. They are easier to remove if the hex head starts to strip. One thing I forgot to photograph was the fact I ground "flats" on the lead screw where the screws from the coupler will touch the lead screw. I also did it where the lock collars screw hits the lead screw.
    DSC_0113.JPG
    I cut two 375mm pieces of 2020 v slot from a piece 750mm long. I then attached them starting at the bottom rear with it 295mm from the back of the uprights. This put the braces at approximately 45 degrees. I used some clamps and 1-2-3 blocks to square up the sides so I could tighten up the braces and Adjustable V-Slot Hinge
    DSC_0017.JPG
    DSC_0020.JPG
    DSC_0132.JPG
    First moves to test out the BlackBox and OpenBuilds Control. I am a fan! Straight forward interface. I took a bit to get it set up due to my stupidity. I could not get it to do anything and then I realized I needed to pick a set-up so I chose the LEAD 1010 just to try it out. This error did get me to triple check the wiring. One weird thing -- and I should have noticed it when I got my order last Fall -- was that instead of getting the 4 wire 7 foot long cable I got a 2 wire approximately 14 foot long cable. o_O But, I did the math and it works. ;) By cutting it in half I had 4 wires 7 feet long and in the end, that was all that mattered. :thumbsup:
    DSC_0023.JPG

     
    #15 Giarc, Sep 26, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2020
  16. sharmstr

    sharmstr Master
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  17. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Yesterday, I recycled an unfinished oak China cabinet base that my dad started probably 30 years ago that we saved while cleaning out a storage locker. This will be the base cabinet. Then I took my old kitchen door that was a solid wood (particle board) core door and cut it down to be the surface on which I will mount the lathe. I had an 8 foot length of steel tubing that made a great cutting guide for the circular saw. Thankfully all the drawer sides were packed away in a box so I can have a nice base cabinet with storage for the lathe.
    DSC_0138.JPG DSC_0139.JPG
    Today, I drew up and cut a quick plate I could cut from scrap acrylic to connect the drag chain to the x gantry so I could easily run the z motor wire to the drag chain.
    DSC_0140.JPG DSC_0145.JPG
    I also cut a piece of 3/16" x 1 1/2" x 1 1/2" aluminum angle I had on hand to 1000mm in length. It was mount across the back of the uprights for the drag chain to run along. I then hooked the wiring up and ran it through the drag chain. I had about 50 feet of shielded wire (4 wire) on hand so I used some of that instead of the wire I used earlier to test it.
    DSC_0147.JPG DSC_0149.JPG DSC_0151.JPG DSC_0150.JPG
     
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  18. Tim Waldvogel

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    I made some similar plates for my LEAD I am working on. I like the idea knowing that the beams are fully supported. I never liked the angle plate design, though I get the cost savings vs custom plates for OpenBuilds Design.

    Great design ! I definitely am interested in adding a 4th axis up the road and I am intrigued by your lathe design.
     
  19. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Thanks.

    I made a few more plates today. I wanted to beef up the braces so I designed some new angled plates. I also wanted to try engraving on them. I have never used such a small diameter endmill on aluminum before, so that was a first for me. I made 4 of them - two were engraved. There will be two on each side.
    DSC_0173.JPG DSC_0166.JPG

    I also made some end plates for the C-Beam that were a little longer so they would be flush with the top angled plates. I put a 6 mm hole in so I could run the wiring from the rotary axis through the C-Beam to the BlackBox on the other side. I made these out of scrap black acrylic I had left over from another project. It had an interesting 'grain.'
    DSC_0161.JPG DSC_0160.JPG
     
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  20. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Faster, faster! come on we want to see this monster turning some wood!
    Jk moving along nicely keep up the great work @Giarc ! :)
     
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  21. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Believe me I want it done too.

    I did find a way to move the tail stock. I had some scraps of 2040 leftover from my original CNC build. I don't know why I kept them, but I am glad I did. Anyways, I drilled holes through the 2040 pieces then drilled and tapped matching holes in the bottom of the tailstock. I remembered reading gwandad had used a 40mm wide piece of aluminum as a slide to line his up with his head stock here C Beam Rotary. So, I plan to use a 1000mm long piece of C-Beam I have that is waiting to be part of my planned upgrade for my CNC router. That means I need to order another piece of C-Beam, so I am glad I have ignored the reminder emails that I have things in my cart. ;)

    DSC_0174.JPG DSC_0185.JPG DSC_0180.JPG

     
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  22. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    Wow. I drilled too many holes. I have one 12mm screw left. I can not think of needing any more, but... DSC_0198.JPG
     
  23. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I also painted all of the plates. I had thought of anodizing, but I have never done it and I was lazy. I was sticking to a theme I came up with when I build my ACME lead screw driven OX.

    DSC_0195.JPG DSC_0197.JPG

    My inspiration
    [​IMG]
     
  24. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    ...and now I have to order the 510 Enclosure. At a 27" wide tabletop it was destiny. I wanted 28" but the doorknob hole prevented that.
    DSC_0199.JPG
    Also, I definitely need more 12 mm screws. I have one whole plate I forgot about. Off to the OpenBuilds Parts Store.
     
  25. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I am considering the 510 OpenBuilds Modular Enclosure System so prior to squaring the machine and permanently fastening it down, a temporarily mounted a piece of V-Slot® 20x20 Linear Rail down to to the table top at the rear so the lather is lined up with the front and back of the table. However, the 510 enclosure is not tall enough so I ordered some 20x20 vslot to make a "hat" if I decide to go that route.
    DSC_0207.JPG
    I also drilled some holes through the 20X80 "feet" and while they were held square and in place by the 90 degree aluminum angle brackets, I screwed them down with three 2" wood screws.
    DSC_0232.JPG
    Before permanently mounting the 20x20 braces, I had to grind off the tiny bit of screw that protruded out the threaded side of the Adjustable V-Slot Hinge for all 4 of them. It was a quick fix with the benchtop disk sander. This had to be done because the screws protruded out enough to interfere with the aluminum plate. If the part was turned around, it was not a problem, but the screw would have to be put in first. The screw makes it hard to access the screw that holds the part on the v-slot to tighten it down, so about 0.5mm had to go. This is not a fault of the part, but a result of me using it for something other than its intended purpose.
    DSC_0203.JPG
    Then I mounted the plates on loosely, squared up the uprights, and tightened everything down.
    DSC_0208.JPG DSC_0211.JPG
    I made a limit switch assembly out of three of the aluminum Cast Corner Bracket s. If only I would have watched an assembly video or two and I would have known there was a much easier (and cheaper) way. But, then I wouldn't have a cool orange mount. I did have to sand one down to make it narrow enough to not interfere with the wheels.
    DSC_0202.JPG
    DSC_0217.JPG DSC_0218.JPG

    All cleaned up and ready for calibration.
    DSC_0231.JPG
     
    #25 Giarc, Oct 25, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2020
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  26. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I got around to calibrating the X, Z, and Y (rotary) axis the other night. I originally used the calibration wizard, but my eyes are not what they used to be and I had a hard time seeing how far off it was in just 100mm. Therefore, I went back to the way I calibrated my first CNC and sent it as far as it I could measure with the ruler I had available, and within the travel constraints of the axis.

    The first check on the X was done by sending it 700mm. I started it at 10 and it ended at a little over 713.
    DSC_0302.JPG
    I guessed it was about 3.1 mm over, so I did the math:

    700/703.1 = 0.9955909543450434.

    0.9955909543450434 x 199.1 steps/mm (OpenBuilds starting setting) = 198.2221590100981 or 198.222 steps/mm

    I then sent it 700mm again and it seemed pretty much spot on. I find it easiest to take a flash photo straight on to eliminate shadows and then I can zoom in on the photo to get a better view.
    DSC_0304.JPG
    I applied this same 198.222 value for the Z and tested it at a 100 mm jog and it also looked spot on. I figured it would be since the screws most likely came from the same batch.

    The fun part was the following math problem for the rotary axis (Y axis). I did not want to type it up again so I grabbed a screen shot from the video. I purchased and plan on using VCarve Desktop and so I needed to figure out the steps/degree. I like how I can import a 3D model, fit it to the stock size I need, and generate the gcode. At least it looks like it should be that easy according to the videos I watched.:)
    upload_2020-10-26_20-21-8.png

    Anyways, I am very impressed with the accuracy of the SANOU headstock. Here is the video of the calibration. I did a 1440 degree test and it was spot on. :thumbsup:


    In the end, these were my steps/mm settings I came up with:
    X = 198.222 steps/mm ($100)
    Y = 26.667 steps/degree ($101) (of course in OpenBuilds control I called it steps/mm)
    Z = 198.222 steps/mm ($102)
     
    #26 Giarc, Oct 27, 2020
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2020
  27. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    I did a whole lot more building, but I just couldn't wait any longer. Also, I am definitely getting an enclosure. The first attempt is at 4000mm/min with a 1/4" 2 flute ball mill at about 18000 rpm and 3.5mm depth of cut. Who needs to 3D print anymore. This is so much faster. ;) This was from a trunk of an arborvitae tree that died. Smells like cedar.

    @Mark Carew you wanted to see it cut. Here you go. One delay was me having to learn how to use VCarve Desktop.


    Finishing pass going on now! What better test than Groot since he is made of wood after all. That and I am a nerd. Bonus: It is a beer tap handle. DSC_0333.JPG
     
    #27 Giarc, Oct 29, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2020
  28. Giarc

    Giarc Master
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    One thing I did notice was that I could not get it to cut if I had homing/limit switches installed and working. It would give me an error. I think it is because of the Y axis.
     
  29. sharmstr

    sharmstr Master
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  30. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    NICE!!! I love it it's alive and doing really great!
    So how did you do the code? Is it athe wrapped code feature in vectric I haven't checked that out yet?
    Is it Grootbeer? lol couldn't help myself :D
    Really great stuff thanks for the share, looking forward to a Christmas present! JK I am looking forward to seeing what other cool stuff you do on this one.
    Keep up the great work @Giarc
     
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