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Reviving the Origonal PhlatPrinter with BlackBox

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by theracermark, May 16, 2021.

  1. theracermark

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    theracermark published a new build:

    Read more about this build...
     
  2. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Project Maker Builder Resident Builder

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    Very cool project Mark! BlackBox on the PhlatPrinter wow man the PhlatPrinter has come a long way. Nice job in bring her back to life:thumbsup:
     
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  3. theracermark

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    Thanks Mark
    it is a real fun thing to me. I enjoy getting older things doing newer work.
    Still plan on getting more done to it and then on the the next project.

    With your help and the help of David the Swarfer I have come a long way in the CNC area in a short time.

    Lots of fun for sure.

    Mark
     
    Mark Carew likes this.
  4. theracermark

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    I posted some pics of the dual stepper setip in the files area. I 3D printed the mounts and made some long rods to hold them together out os some old 700 Heli FlyBar rods. They worked perfectly. Cut them off and threaded the ends for nuts and will have installed pics next week after the timing belts and 5mm hard couplers come in. Today was spent on designing a new gantry mount for the Dremel tool. the U Bolts just have no real retention ability. the new mounts will be done later tonight so look for pics tomorrow.
    Mark
     
  5. JustinTime

    JustinTime Journeyman
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    I'm curious why you need two steppers per axis. The old one didn't 'cut it'? (Pun intended!) :)
     
  6. theracermark

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    Nice one for sure

    I just wanted to be able to turn up the speed and since I had several other steppers doing nothing I decided to double the ability. It will not work out to be a full double power but much better than one. it cuts just fine but I think I will be able to cut faster and heaver cuts. The single setup just wanted to miss stepps and get off track so to speak. Also it is an interesting experiament for sure. Hope to fire it up this week.

    Mark
     
  7. theracermark

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    I just posted 2D image of the Dremel Spindle Mount upgrade. installed pictures to follow. The mounting holes get a 3/8x24 tap and the bolts tighten like in ALU. I am doing the mad to the Dremel to have the cort exit the body at an angle to add clearance to the belt and pulleys.
     
  8. theracermark

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    Just Posted the final assembly pics of the spindle and carriage assembly. Added all the wiring with terminal blocks and installed the E Stops at both ends of the Z axis. also i added a screw to retain the bushings that slide on the X axis rods.
    Next step is the X and Y motor assemblys.

    Mark
     
  9. theracermark

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    I posted this in the BllackBox thread

    I am trying to sort out the correct wiring for the dual stepper motors on my PhlatPrinter 1. it had been suggested to wire in Paralell. I have found many wiring diagrams that have the B windings reversed and other things. If i wire the motors in direct same wire to same wire the motors are locked.
    Can anyone point me to the correct wiring for the BlackBox as many posts on line claim the drivers make a difference in how the winding should be and I do not want to damage anything.

    Mark
     
  10. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    See docs:blackbox:faq-identify-motor-coils [OpenBuilds Documentation] to understand stepper wiring a little better

    If you want to parallel two motors onto one driver, you just parallel them together. Red to red, blue to blue, yellow to yellow etc, and then insert the twister together pairs into the correct pin of the 4 pin connector on the driver (as identified above, or from the motor datasheet)

    You mean when you try to spin them by hand? That is expected, as you try to (and please never do) spin one motor by hand, it acts as a generator, tries to feed the other motor, and get it to spin. Thus the resistance you feel.

    Back to the never do part: Do not spin stepper motors by hand when connected to a controller -as they also act as generator, thus backfeeding the driver which can (well, will) damage the drivers. ONLY move motors by hand when completely disconnected, or using software jogging with the controller

    We don't have documentation for parallel motors, because BlackBox has a spare driver output. But if ever in doubt on the dubious online claims, refer to docs.openbuilds.com or ask here :) - other sources, we cannot vouch for.
     
  11. theracermark

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    Thanks Peter
    I will get that wired and give it a try.
    I do not spin the motors as I do know they are generators. I just found it strange that they were completely locked, which is different from only one motor wired up.

    Not to keep you bysy but is there any benefits to wiring in Series.

    Mark
     
  12. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    Rest assured, thats perfectly normal :)

    How is the two motors mounted by the way, does one need to counter rotate? Or both spinning same direction. Forgot to mention above but if ones rotation has to be reversed just swop its wiring over

    So 1,2,3,4 on motor one and 4,3,2,1 on motor two

    Not with out systems. If you ran high voltage drivers you would maybe, but parallel is easier, and better with a 24v setup
     
  13. theracermark

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  14. theracermark

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    Sio as I was wiring the Stepper motors I needed to disconett the X threaded rod and decided to add a Tenisioning plate t the end mount to stop whipping. I think it turned out nice. aluminum plate with a Ball Bearing captured with a threaded insert to screw the rod into. The insert has threads and a step to catch aginst the Bng and it is threaded to securre it to the rod. there will be a set screw in the end to lock it to the rod after tension is added.

    Mark
     
  15. theracermark

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    Well I have started to change the setup on the BlackBox to speedup the motors. The X was first. The old X settings were
    X OLD NEW
    MM per Min 300 575
    Acceleration 30 60

    Z OLD NEW
    MM per Min 300 675
    Acceleration 30 80

    working on the Y and will report.
    Mark
     
  16. theracermark

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    Well the Y came in even better.
    MM per MIN Old New
    1000 2000

    Acceleration 60 100

    This thing ROCKS.
    I tested and setup the dual motor settings using a Gcode test string of

    G00 X-100;
    G00 X0;

    G00 Y-100;
    G00 Y0;

    G00 Z-15;
    G00 Z0;

    Repeted 10 times each

    I then increassed the settings till i got lost steps and reduced the numbers to 80% which left me the above.

    Also the tention bearing at the end of the X axis really helped. There is NO flopping around, like it used to, of the lead screw at all.

    I must say the really cool part is what I am learning from the guys here, staff as well as all of the members contributions.

    Mark
     
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  17. theracermark

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    I just posted new pics of the X and Y dual Stepper setup. It is working great. I have a bit os cleaning up wires and adding the X limit switches and will start a cut on another airplane. I think this setup will allow me to cut maybe 1/4 plywood but cut much quicker and more accuratly. Cant wait to try the plysood. I have a couple of PP1 parts I want to make for replacement.
    Full setup pics by the first of the week.

    Thanks for watching ALL
    Mark
     
  18. theracermark

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    Hi All
    I did some dry cuts today and this thing is fast now!!!!!

    I added the X limitg switch one because I ran out and ordered some more.

    My big question is how do I make the home all Just Home X and Z. The Y being a roller is infinite. What i really need it to do is Home Z then home X then pull Y in the + direction some preset amount. It would be nice if it did the pull + during the Home all so if I set the sheet to be cut at the front edge of thePP1 Box it would end up with the front edge at 0.00, that of courst would be just at the edge of the router bit.

    So how do I change the Home Y to do this.

    Other than that I am almost finished with this part of the PP1 Revival.
    Do not confuse this to be I will not do any other upgrades as I have a couple more already in mind.

    Thanks for any help
    Mark
     
    #18 theracermark, Jun 17, 2021 at 7:19 PM
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2021 at 6:58 AM
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  19. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    By recompiling grbl: see the comment in config.h about changing homing order
     
  20. David the swarfer

    David the swarfer OpenBuilds Team
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    you mean Y is the roller, Z is the router movement, X is the carriage side to side
     
  21. theracermark

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    Yes that is correct sorry I corrected the post
    Thanks David
    Mark
     
    #21 theracermark, Jun 18, 2021 at 6:53 AM
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2021 at 6:59 AM

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