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More Dust Collection UPDATE

Discussion in 'Concepts and Ideas' started by Metalguru, Oct 7, 2016.

  1. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    Just had a client request for a Dust Shoe type of collector. He didn't like my Cheep and Dirty dust collection system:(

    I had a look around on the web, and the only thing I really liked was Kent CNC, but I couldn't see paying double what my router cost just for a dust shoe, (he does really nice work, mind). So, I whipped up a Sketchup model of one I thought would be useful.

    It features:
    • Mounts on the standard OB router mount with screws
    • Has an 8mm thick clear Acrylic top, so you can see what the router is doing
    • Has a couple of LED light bars mounted under the router, also so you can see what the router is doing. These run off 24v so you can just tie them into the stepper power supply
    • uses inexpensive brush type Door Sweep brushes that I picked up for $10 a meter
    • Should be inexpensive to build.
    This is the door sweep

    20161007_175547.jpg


    So, I had some more time to work on this last week, and came up with a passable imitation of an actual dust shoe.

    I cut a base plate from 8mm clear acrylic. Then I cut two side plates that were about the same length as the side of a router mount. I then proceeded to butcher some slots into these plates that will fit the tapped holes in the side of the router mount. Believe me, it's not as easy to machine acrylic as it looks. I tried a couple of different bits, but got pretty poor results. I think the main problem was too low a feed speed, and to high a router RPM. I was just using my fixed speed Bosch Colt, so that was part of the problem. I am going to have to practice on some scrap to get this down. Anyway, they are good enough for the kind of girls I go out with...

    20161107_154017.jpg

    I then used hole saws to cut a 3" hole near the back for router clearance, and a smaller 1.5" hole for the hose connector. I cut the large router hole into a slot so the shoe could be slipped on over the router without disconnecting anything or disturbing the router mount. The hose connection is just a vacuum hose multi diameter adapter from the local woodworking store, with the flange cut off, glued into place. I put it off to the side and the front as far as I could so you could see what the router is doing without it being in the way. BTW, hole sawing acrylic is another PITA, it keeps melting and clogging up the saw, even at my drill press's lowest speed.

    I then glued these side plates onto the base plate, after bolting them onto the router mount to maintain the correct spacing. I used Methylene Chloride to glue them on, nasty stuff but small enough quantities to be relatively safe.

    Oh, by the way, to get a nice smooth clear finish on the edges, just sand them down nice and smooth to about 220 grit, and then use a small butane torch to "flame polish" the edges. This is also tricky to do without setting the acrylic on fire. Keep the torch moving, and quickly...

    After letting the glue dry, I cut and mounted the brush sides on with some 3M VHB mounting tape. Love that stuff. Sticks like poop to a blanket. Note that the brush is just held into the aluminum channel in one spot with a dimple hammered into the channel. You will have to add new dimples for each cut piece to keep the brush from sliding out.

    I then mounted a couple of 3 LED strips that I bought under the top, one on each side. These are 12v strips, so I wired them in series to get a strip operated from 24V, which I then wired directly into the motor power supply. A pair of 2.1mm coaxial connectors allows the wire to be disconnected to remove the shoe.

    20161107_153937.jpg


    Here are a couple of shots of the shoe mounted on an OX. Works well. Note that there is no brush on the back, as the shoe slides on from the front and can't have anything in the way across the back. Need some air flow room in order to get good suction anyway.


    20161105_150727.jpg

    Works well, there is lots of adjustment for different length bits and router heights, and it seems to collect dust really well.


    20161105_150716.jpg

    Overall, it works good, but it's a bit of a pain to take it off to change or adjust bits. You have to remove 4 screws to get it off. I wanted to do a magnetic mount with some rare earth magnets, but I didn't have time to figure out an easy way to do it. I think next time instead of using 8mm acrylic, I will use two pieces of 6mm with pressed in magnets and mating flat metal washers. Lee Valley Tools make nifty little magnet cups and pole washers for various sized rare earth magnets that they sell. with the top part mounted on the router, and the brushes mounted on the bottom part, it would be simple to just snap off the brushes to get at the router for bit changes.

    As someone mentioned, I would like to use thumbscrews for the mounting, but so far haven't found any in M5.

    MG
     
    #1 Metalguru, Oct 7, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  2. Gary Caruso

    Gary Caruso Veteran
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    My plan is to make a shoe that is fixed in regards to Z axis so that you can set the bristles to the work surface height.
    And to use extra long Z axis wheel bolts to mount the hardware.
    I made one for an x-carve, turned out real nice, I found flexible "brush for cnc" on ebay.
    The first brush I purchased was like yours but i didn't think to use square corners!
    If you turn the 4 screws into thumb screw knobs might be easier?
    i like the extra LED's, can never have enough light
    Gary
     
  3. GrayUK

    GrayUK Master
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    The vacuum pipes on dust shoes always worry me, with regard to putting stress, on the pivot point on the Z axis.
    On my next machine, I plan to have an additional fixing point above the spindle, so that the piece of pipe from the shoe, is rigid and part of the Z axis, traveling with the the spindle across the X axis.
    Because this will be a C Beam machine, with a fixed gantry, I'm considering adding a cross beam on the X axis, about 12 inches above the existing C Beam, with maybe a small running trolley attached. The vacuum hose will be attached to this trolley, hanging loosely and suspended above the machine, and then be attached to the pipe.
    Hopefully this would remove any drag or pulling on the actual dust shoe itself. :)
    Gray
     
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  4. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    Gray:

    I have a vacuum port on the ceiling above my workbench. I have a household built in vacuum system plumbed all over my shop with hard 2" tubing so I have hose inlets all over the shop. There is never one more than a couple of meters from my equipment or benches. I just use a short piece of vacuum hose essentially straight up to the fixed pipe. This puts very little stress on the dust shoe.

    I have updated this dust shoe a bit with a swiveling dust port so that the hose can freely swivel to prevent binding. I can also use a 90 degree, 45 degree, or straight port on the swivel depending on where the vac hose is located. The black fitting is able to swivel 360 degrees for a straight fitting, or 180 in the case of an elbow.


    20161219_161056.jpg

    MG
     
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  5. GrayUK

    GrayUK Master
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    Dam! I wish my workshop was as well organised! Extraction is something I must give more consideration to when I gut my workshop sometime this year. 2017! :rolleyes:
    That swivel looks really cool, I might try to find one for myself. :thumbsup:
    But I see you understand my concern with regard to vacuum pipe drag.
    As you say, the rear of your shoe is open, well, how about fitting a small blower, like a cooling jet at the rear, to cool the bit, plus blow debris towards the extractor pipe? :rolleyes:
    Cheers
    Happy New Year :D
    Gray
     
  6. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    Gray, you could easily use one of those flexible blower nozzles aimed in the back to make sure everything goes toward the front vacuum pickup. I find that the vacuum suction is enough to pull in most of the debris, just a small amount of stuff with sufficient escape velocity gets out the back.

    As far as the swivel, as you can see I just used standard plumbing fittings made for sink drain pipes. Not sure if you have the same system in the UK. I drilled a hole in the plexi base just a bit bigger than the OD of the 1 1/2" pipe. I cut a ring off a female pipe fitting and glued it on, using a piece of pipe long enough to friction fit into the elbow fitting to make a press fit and leave enough of a gap so that it would swivel freely. This allows me to disassemble it if I want to change out fittings or something. No glue was used.

    The organization is a deception, I just cleaned up the portion of my workbench large enough to take a picture. The rest of my shop is a mess. But, there is a place for everything, just not everything makes it back to its place...o_O The central vacuum system was on my list of priorities, no wood shop should be without one. Next on my list is a central air compressor with air lines plumbed all over...

    MG
     
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  7. Alex Burnett

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  8. Alex Burnett

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    I have just got my OX machine working and am looking for a suitable dust collector, the best I have seen is built by Marius Hornburger, on You Tube. it clicks into place easily on super magnets and id set at the project height so that the cutter goes up and down inside it. That means that it must be mounted to the non moving backplate. Have a look at Marius's site, it's very good.
     
  9. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    I agree it's nice, but also a huge amount of work. I could easily see it taking a whole day to build this thing. I don't see the need to have it in a fixed position attached to the non moving portion of the Z axis either. Typically, the Z axis only moves a fraction of an inch for most cuts. If your brush is long enough, it won't make a difference.

    Also, unless your Z axis is the fixed type c-beam with the router mounted on a moving gantry plate, like the original C-Beam Machine, there is no fixed place to mount the dust shoe. With the Ox and most designs like it, the wheels will get in the way and there is no way to mount a fixed design dust shoe.

    My design is simple, effective, and takes only an hour or two to build, especially if you don't bother with details like flame polishing the edges, LED lighting, etc. Granted, it's a bit of a pain to change bits, but if you use thumbscrews to mount it it.s no big deal.

    MG
     
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  10. Ernest Sutherland

    Ernest Sutherland Well-Known
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    I will take one lool
     
  11. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    I can send you the sketchup drawing and you can make it using your cnc mill...

    MG
     
  12. Gary Caruso

    Gary Caruso Veteran
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    It's not hard to mount, i hate smashing down brushes when its a 3/4" thick cut.. the low profile brush looks better too IMO, but as long as it works right?
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    That's pretty cool, Gary. Innovative way to mount the dust shoe. However, I still think the router mount using worm gear clamps used on the original OX design leaves a lot to be desired... The OB router mount is a lot better.

    MG
     
  14. Gary Caruso

    Gary Caruso Veteran
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    Are you talking about the original with the cast corners? That's not what this is.. :)
     
  15. Metalguru

    Metalguru Master
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    Well, even the OB mounts use cast corners to hold them on. IMHO Seems like a bit of a backward step to go to the 8 wheel C-Beam Z axis and then use light duty router mounts.

    For the $30 or whatever the OB router mount is, it's well worth it. With the Dewalt, and the Makita as well, because they have the long barrel, you can use 2 OB router mounts for even more stiffness. Chris Laidlaw sells some really nice mounts also, custom sized for your router, which are a cut above for use with the C-Beam axis.

    Extra Strong Double Router Mount

    Designed to Order Router/Spindle Mount for most Routers/Spindles and CNCs | eBay

    MG
     
  16. Gary Caruso

    Gary Caruso Veteran
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    Isn't this thread about dust collectors? :D The mount is definitely not the weak link in my ox, there is more gantry flex and z/x wheel flex than the mount probably 100x more (made up number for sure). Some day i do plan on making an all aluminum mount for it, but for now its been fine, definitely not holding it back one bit. Regarding cast corners I remember the original mount using cast corners to cradle the router, I thought you were talking about that. I'm well aware of Chris's mounts and the OB mount, got my plates from him.. the OB mount needs shims for the Makita, not going to spend $60 on a mount that needs shims. I already have some 1/2" aluminum to make my own.
    Cheers
     

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