Welcome to Our Community

Some features disabled for guests. Register Today.

OpenBuilds LEAD CNC

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by MaryD, Nov 20, 2018.

  1. Margolek

    Margolek New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hello
    Can i use cap head screws instead of low profile screws ?
     
  2. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Project Maker Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2013
    Messages:
    2,497
    Likes Received:
    1,981
    In most places this should not be an issue but in areas like the back of the gantry carts where is limited clearance you may need to do some grinding down on those particular heads.
     
  3. technerd

    technerd New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2019
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    2
    Hi,

    I have a quick question. I was following the instructions here to assemble my LEAD Machine: (around 30 minute mark). Getting to the point of mounting the Y-axis drag chain and I realized the threaded hole on the 20x40 is in the top, not the bottom. Does it matter if I use the top one instead of the bottom one in the video?
     
  4. NoStNick

    NoStNick New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hi all, I'm new to all this and about to pull the trigger on a Lead machine. Doing my research and this was the first post I've read that's relevant to my imagined use case. I'm a repair tech in a guitar shop and will eventually be using it for custom builds but want to start off with simpler builds like speaker cabs, guitar stands, basic sheet good stuff. I would also like to use the machine unpowered at times as an overhead router for quick guitar mods like battery cavities, enlarging pickup routes, larger bridge routes, etc. It seems like a much quicker/more accurate operation than setting up the plunge router, finding or making a routing template, stripping the guitar parts... basically relying on locking stops in the rails to set my dimensions.

    So with that in mind a couple questions. How well will free hand plunging work? I'm assuming the spindle stays put while the z stepper is not under power. Is there room on that part of the assembly for vertical lock stops? Handles? Will there still be too much resistance without power to move the spindle manually through cuts?

    Am I crazy or just ignorant?
     
  5. Giarc

    Giarc Master
    Moderator Builder

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2015
    Messages:
    1,647
    Likes Received:
    859
    One problem is that as you move your axis around, or up and down, the steppers act like generators and produce electricity which can damage your electronics. If you disconnected them, it may not be so bad, but the screws on the Z and other axis will not allow you to move it well at all by hand.
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  6. NoStNick

    NoStNick New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1
    Had a feeling that was the case.
     
  7. Alex Chambers

    Alex Chambers Master
    Moderator Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    1,471
    Likes Received:
    674
    But you could send the code for a move - ie use the stepper motors to move the router around while cutting. Would be a bit slower than hand routing with a template. You would probably find it's not that difficult to programme say a pocket, line the workpiece (guitar body?) up and clamp it and then run the code to cut the pocket. Drawing the design on computer would be a quicker than cutting a template, and probably quicker to find again if you wanted to do it again in future.
    Alex.
     
  8. NoStNick

    NoStNick New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1
    Looking at the drawing I should be able to quickly detach the nut blocks from the gantry plates (and try not to lose the washers). The Z screw is the hang up then. It would be nice to have some resistance while plunging the spindle so I suppose I can unlock the coupling up top and leave the Z screw nut block engaged.
     
  9. NoStNick

    NoStNick New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1
    My plan was to use stops in the rails to set my boundaries rather than mess with templates.
     
  10. Alex Chambers

    Alex Chambers Master
    Moderator Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    1,471
    Likes Received:
    674
    But for the sort of jobs you described it really wouldn't be difficult to programme the machine - your drawing would define the boundaries - including the depth.
    Alex.
     
  11. NoStNick

    NoStNick New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1
    That is a goal, eventually. I won't feel comfortable putting a customers guitar under the tool until I have a good bit of programming experience with it.
     
  12. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Project Maker Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    4,269
    Likes Received:
    1,551
    CAM up the job, stick a piece of scrap in, run test, happy, place expensive guitar in place :)
    The number of times a router has yanked away while I hold it in my hands (even with a template) i'd rather trust the machine (;
     
    Alex Chambers likes this.
  13. Alex Chambers

    Alex Chambers Master
    Moderator Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2018
    Messages:
    1,471
    Likes Received:
    674
    Another advantage would be that you don't have to have anything touching the surface of the guitar.
    Alex.
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  14. Batcrave

    Batcrave Journeyman
    Builder

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2018
    Messages:
    334
    Likes Received:
    147
    I'm with Alex & Peter in thinking that manually pushing around the gantry is a just generally a Bad Idea. Aside from the problems mentioned, the gantry is going to want to rack itself because you're going to have trouble pushing both sides evenly. Also, while those nut blocks will come off easily, I can tell you from experience that they're a whole lot more challenging to get back on again & require really tiny fingers.

    If, however, you're dead set on the idea & willing to go out of your way to achieve it, here are a couple thoughts:

    - With a heavy spindle (my 80mm water-cooled job, for instance) the Z will just barely stay up when unpowered. Putting just a little force will gently lower it. Raising it manually, on the other hand, is a struggle - especially if you're having to reach across the machine bed to do it.

    - The X & Y axes will take an uncomfortable amount of force to move around manually. The only way I can see it working is to replace the leadscrews with ballscrews, which will glide far more willingly. I don't know if this is a mod anyone has tried or documented yet. This would also lessen the chances of racking the gantry, but wouldn't necessarily eliminate it. You might still have to find some way to reinforce the structure to keep it rigid.

    - You might (strictly theoretically) be able to address the racking by coupling the two leadballscrews with pulleys and a timing belt, keeping both screws turning in sync. Maybe.

    - Bear in mind I haven't actually worked with ballscrews or belt drives before.

    - If you did couple the gantry screws (even if you stuck with leadscrews) you could potentially put on hand cranks and run the machine like a manual mill. You may find that you'll have to crank awfully fast, though, unless you replace the standard screws with something with a steeper pitch or more starts. I built my first machine (an XY table with Z on a fixed gantry, which made things easier) with handcranks, and eventually pulled them off in frustration (and because they kept snagging anything in reach when the steppers were running).

    And, again, I really don't think this is the right way to go about it. I don't think your idea's impossible, but getting it to behave like you're expecting is likely to be a lot of work in mostly unexplored territory - especially as an inexperienced machine builder - and the time, energy, and money would likely be far better spent experimenting with some scrap pieces until you get the hang of CNC'ing the cuts you need to make.

    If you're going to be working on existing guitar bodies, you might also want to look into 3D digitizing probes, so you can scan the surface & make sure everything's going exactly where it should be & aligned exactly how it should (it'll also allow for fun things like engraving on curved objects), but I'm not sure what GRBL software supports it, and I hesitate to recommend going the Mach3/LinuxCNC +Gecko (or *shudder* random Chinese electronics) route for all but the most ambitious beginner.


    -Bats
    (Purveyor of bad ideas)
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  15. NoStNick

    NoStNick New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2020
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    1
    Great advice. I appreciate your input. I'll ditch the unpowered idea. The 3d probe sounds promising, I'll have to read up on that. Could be a great tool for copying hand carved prototypes.
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  16. Rob Taylor

    Rob Taylor Veteran
    Builder

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2013
    Messages:
    794
    Likes Received:
    344
    You can directly type in line-by-line G-code or just jog- it's perfectly possible to use a CNC machine manually or semi-manually, not everything has to be fully-CAMed up. I do it all the time. For straight-line stuff that's just a few lines of code, it's the way to go. Just get used to setting arbitrary WCS zeroes wherever you happen to jog to.

    And bCNC allows digitizing.
     
  17. Batcrave

    Batcrave Journeyman
    Builder

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2018
    Messages:
    334
    Likes Received:
    147
    Good catch. I meant to mention that option too, but got a little distracted by all my less realistic suggestions.

    G-code is a little intimidating at first (and a little intuitive never), but just going Point A to Point B is really quite simple (G1 X1 Y2 F40 is "go to x1, y2 at 40 [units] per minute). The one big drawback to entering code line-by-line (especially if you're using a fast fixed-speed router) is that if you're not quick enough you can end up with the tool sitting, rubbing (which reduces tool life), and potentially burning the wood - so I try to end my moves off the stock when possible.

    Of course, that only works for simple shapes. A neck pocket, definitely... but the electronics on a strat would probably be better CAMed, unless you're a whole lot better than me.

    I thought it might, but a quick search didn't give me anything definite.

    One caveat on bCNC, though... get used to working in metric. It mostly supports inches, but I discovered the hard way that some functions are unpredictable in inch mode, or would cause it to change units without notice.


    -Bats
    (finder of improbable problems)
     
  18. bo Toepfer

    Builder

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2020
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    3
    I just got started with my build, I must say the box of parts was a bit intimidating, I has no idea what parts where what I started with the wheels , I kept going the best I could then it dawned on me the numbers on some of the bags refer to the MM of those parts, The XL plate that laminated to the two other plates could use more detail in its orientation. I noticed the marking of the support beans with a permanent marker , Why not run some painters tape on the top and mark the tape?. Lastly In my box I see a cardboard box with a power device, in it,, what is the "Black Box packaged in? Thanks Bo
     
    #768 bo Toepfer, Jul 16, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2020
  19. sergiomajluf

    Builder

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2020
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hi!
    How firmly should the delrin nut blocks be tightened? After putting the machine together, I have all 7 (2/X, 4/Y, 1/Z) of them somewhat loose.

    Specially I can see the Y-axis nuts move at the gantry plate when I move the machine. But when I thighten them I start loosing steps.

    As a reference, when I cut down power, Z axis slowly goes down with a 1,5Kw spindle, so it is kindda loose. But if I tighten them all, I should increase driver current close to its limit

    Thanks!
     
    #769 sergiomajluf, Aug 2, 2020 at 6:10 PM
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2020 at 6:15 PM
  20. JustinTime

    JustinTime Journeyman
    Builder

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2013
    Messages:
    242
    Likes Received:
    60
    Could it be that you have small steppers? They should really be NEMA 23 with maybe 260oz/inch torque
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice