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C-Beam™ Machine - Plate Maker

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by Mark Carew, Jul 16, 2015.

  1. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    Hey gang. Quick question as I circle ever-closer to actually getting this thing to cut something other than air...

    After a few tests, I think I have my Y axis reversed. I'm using TinyG, and when I watch the display in Chillipepper, I realized that the 3D despiction shows the tool going toward the back of the machine - but in reality it's moving toward the front (because the bed is moving back). I'm afraid I've made a stupid mistake due to the X & Z moving typically, but the Y bed moving opposite to get the tool to the front - which is opposite of the way my brain works :)

    Is this something that I need to flip in the basic TinyG setup (I used CoolTemp for setup)? Or is it due to the fact that I used the rear (Y max) limit switch as my homing so that the spindle would be front left for start?

    I'm thoroughly confused.

    Thanks for any light you can shed on this final darkness I'm having with this build!
     
  2. KerryH

    KerryH Journeyman
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    The easiest thing is to just reverse one pair of wires for the stepper. IE on my steppers I have red, blue, black, green. If I want to reverse the direction I simply swap the red and blue so the new wiring would be blue, red, black, green.
     
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  3. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    Thanks so much for the reply!

    You know, I just tried that in the TinyG software to test it out (polarity reverse - thanks Davey!). Now the jogging is moving opposite of the direction I'd assume/want. So if I hit jog Y(-) it moves the bed moves backwards. Y(+) makes the bed move forwards. So this means the spindle is moving to the front of the bed in minus/negative direction. I was under the impression that Y(+) was to the back of the bed (therefore bed forward on the frame.

    Maybe being new to the CNC world, I'm married to the traditional thought process here???

    If having the Y work in reverse is ok, next up would be figuring out how to make the spindle home itself to the front left corner. After reversing polarity - it's now shooting the spindle to the back to home itself. Should I just consider the back left corner of the bed "home" and call it a day?

    EDIT: I got the homing to work the way I figured it should (front left corner). Just need confirmation that having Y(-) is cool for the bed moving back/spindle moving forward. I suppose if it works, it works...right?

    Thanks for your patience.
     
    #153 motopreserve, Aug 5, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2015
  4. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Correct :thumbsup:
    Check out the build video where we take our first steps
    First Steps

    Also have a look at this axis reference pic
    OpenBuilds CBeam Machine Axis Reference Picture.jpg
     
  5. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    I can't believe I missed that. I watched it twice - but I think I stopped short since I was using a different controller. Great video by the way!

    I'm fine if this diagram works. Just goes against everything I've known from manual milling (the old point Left hand - fingers like gun trick).

    Thanks folks. Appreciate the help.
     
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  6. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Thanks for the kind words @motopreserve yes the Y is a bit confusing on this set up, just that way it worked out for this one.
    Glad to be a help
    BTW you may want to check out the post (a page back) in case you missed it, where we talk about bolting the MDF table down instead of the self tappers if you have not done this already. It may save you some time in the long run.
    http://www.openbuilds.com/threads/c-beam™-machine-plate-maker.2349/page-5#post-20698
    Keep up the good work your almost there :)
     
  7. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    Yep. Saw that - and @Davey Rance had already mentioned trying something different on that part - so it made sense when I saw you all talking about it.

    I think I'm going to try my hand at setting up some t-slots, so I'll make the change when I get to that.
     
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  8. David the swarfer

    David the swarfer OpenBuilds Team
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    remember that the axis directions refer to TOOL MOTION.
    ie +Y is tool away from you
    X+ is tool to the right
    and Z+ is tool UP
     
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  9. tim-tim

    tim-tim New
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    Does anyone know when the xPRO will be back in stock? Or where can one be purchased in the US (in stock)?

    Do you have any other suggestions for places with extremely poor internet signal?
     
  10. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    That's what I have always been taught. But in this case, the tool is moving opposite on the Y axis (exactly as shown in the drawing @Mark Carew posted).

    The other axis are currently working as I've always been accustomed to, and the way you describe above.
     
  11. David the swarfer

    David the swarfer OpenBuilds Team
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    instead of reversing the motor by chaning wires, you need to do it in the controller setup so that it knows the correlation between the keys you press then the motor direction.
     
  12. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    Thanks David.

    Currently, I have changed it using the controller only (polarity reverse in TinyG). I had planned on swapping the wires at some point instead - but you just saved me from having to monkey with those tiny screws :)

    Unfortunately, it still acts reversed, based on the graphic depiction on the Chillipepper jog controls at least. I will try to jog using UGCSender and see if there is a difference. Haven't had a chance to try an air cut yet to see if in fact the machine is at least doing as its told (gcode-wise).

    I'm also going to watch the end of @Mark Carew video to see if I'm missing something stupid.

    I'm wondering if I've missed something in the tinyG settings that will account for this?
     
    #162 motopreserve, Aug 6, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2015
  13. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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  14. Brad Hess

    Brad Hess Well-Known
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    I got my C-Beam machine earlier today and went ahead and built it this evening. Very simple build with a great build video to go along with it. Took me about 3-4 hrs with some interruptions. Waiting on my smoothieboard controller to arrive and I can fire it up.
     
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  15. Colin Russon

    Colin Russon Journeyman
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    Just finished this design for a client, machine is 500x750mm based on the C-Beam Machine, more details, parts list etc. as soon as I get time.
     

    Attached Files:

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  16. charliex

    charliex Journeyman
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    possibly obvious, but wasn't to me when i first used the TinyG did you reboot it after changing settings? i monkeyed around with a stepper for ages not realising this the first time i used the tinyg after switching from the smooothieboard.
     
  17. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    Thanks.

    I did reboot. I basically reboot each time I make a change and then double check to make sure that the settings have taken hold :)

    Seems like I am finally getting somewhere. The mechanical side of things have been very smooth. The software....not so much. But as of now - it looks like the darn thing is doing what it's told.

    Fixing the plate/bed with bolts, and then I can move on to leveling the bed and first test cuts.
     
  18. Davey Rance

    Davey Rance Journeyman
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    Charliex, Motopreserve there is a new firmware ending in 18 for the tinyg that fixes the you have to reboot the tinyg each time you make a firmware change.

    Just make sure that you do the save settings in Chillippr or $$ copy and paste before you do it and nuke all of your settings in the firmware update.
     
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  19. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    I think that's the one I'm on. I just still reboot for major changes, because I don't trust it :)

    Got the bed secure with bolts instead of the self-tapping screws. Much more solid now.
     
  20. charliex

    charliex Journeyman
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    nice!
     
  21. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    I personally think you would be fine with a spindle that tops out at 24k RPM - in fact you may find yourself wanting to work more in the lower rpm range that these routers can get to.

    I ended up going with the Dewalt 611 - but ultimately I'd like to have a speed controlled spindle that operates at lower rpm for certain materials.

    If I were you, I'd plug some numbers into a feed and speed calculator for the tooling/materials you plan on using. I think you'll find that lower rpm is a welcomed addition to the rig.
     
  22. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    Sorry, I haven't even cut anything yet :).

    I am confident that it should cut fine for my initial needs (based on @Mark Carew video of milling aluminum). I would just be more comfortable with a spindle that is capable of lower RPM, but that's based on my experience with my vertical mill, which I always operate at a fraction of the speed of this router. I may end up being happy with this setup for quite some time - wouldn't be prudent to judge until I actually get some time with the machine in action.

    I'm using the steppers that they sell at the OpenBuilds store. Again, Mark seemed confident that they would handle the basic tasks. I think this setup is looking good for what it is designed for. I think before I spentd too much time/money trying to make it something it's not - I'd probably move on to a second build that is tailor made for what I need, based on my experience with this one and using this machine to make the plates for a larger setup.
     
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  23. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    I confirmed with Mark before I purchased if he thought the 175oz (from store and video) would be an issue - knowing that was the one that came with the bundle. So he was confident at the time. But I can't imagine more would be worse :)
     
  24. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Hi @Jonatan Rullman yes we are using the OpenBuilds Nema 23 steppers (175oz) on our build and they are working great. With these 1/8th" bits (as with any bit) you do not want to push to hard and these 23's have more then enough push to get the job done with a lead configuration like this. The type of material being cut will dictate how fast it can be cut.
    We apologize that the Nema 23's are out of stock at the moment but we are looking to have them back in stock this week.
    Thanks Jonatan
     
  25. Laurence Carroll

    Laurence Carroll Well-Known
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    Thank goodness for that Mark... I dont think I would have been able to cut it myself...Thanks...Laurie
     
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  26. Mark Carew

    Mark Carew OpenBuilds Team
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    Hello Jonatan,
    The Keling look like nice steppers and the price is not bad. The extra power is not necessary but hey if you can get it why not have it :)
    As for the psu yes you could use the 48v as long as your driver can handle it. The higher voltage will result in the stepper motor coils being charged a little sooner so they are a little quicker to react which is a good thing.
    As for the spindle, that I cannot say as I have never used one.
    Mark
     
  27. Davey Rance

    Davey Rance Journeyman
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    @Jonatan Rullman One benefit most likely of the water cooled spindle is that you should be able to control the spindle speed in software rather than having to do things like put a stripe on the speed control dial on the top of the router.

    So depending on the board that you plan on controlling the unit with that may be a very good thing.
     
  28. motopreserve

    motopreserve Veteran
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    +1. This would be very nice to have!
     
  29. tim-tim

    tim-tim New
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    Ordered my kit over the weekend. Can't wait for it to arrive!
     
  30. Tyler Harney

    Tyler Harney Well-Known
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    Just got done building mine. The build video was very helpful and went along without a hitch. Seems like a really sturdy machine. I've got a 800w watercooled spindle & vfd that I'll be swapping on and off between my machines. I'm also printing a 65mm to 71mm adapter as I type this. I also designed the acrylic sides a tad shorter to be cut on my laser cutter. Jussst clears the 500mm beam.
    2015-08-10 17.13.22.jpg
     
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