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C-Beam™ Machine - Plate Maker

Discussion in 'CNC Mills/Routers' started by Mark Carew, Jul 16, 2015.

  1. Jimmybuckets

    Jimmybuckets Well-Known
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  2. Ronald van Arkel

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    Hello Jimmy,

    The double wide C-beam gantry plate does improve the sturdiness of the Z-axis, resulting in less flexion and thus less "wobble" on the router collet/end mill. It might be tricky to put on as you will need to adjust the wheels first. I adjusted the wheels 2 at a time when sliding the wheels into the C-Beam.

    -Ronald
     
  3. Jimmybuckets

    Jimmybuckets Well-Known
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    Once I get fully up and running will prob do it. Also put a second router mount so there are two holding the router.
     
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  4. clovenedhoof

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    Hey, I just read this entire discussion, and I wanted to get maybe get some direction. I'm really torn between a couple different designs on this site, and I would really appreciate some direction.

    I engrave industrial warning labels, out of titanium, they are usually around 2x4x.125 inches. Right now I use a taig cnc mill, my usual set up is a 1/16th carbide ball endmill a .004 to .01 DOC and about 20-30 IPM. Some of my lettering is 1/8th inch high, so resolution is very important to me. It's slow work! I can usually mount 4 plates to my mill, but I need to ramp up production. I was considering buying a new TAIG, but I think a CNC router of some sort will be way better. Currently I use the stock Taig motor, which is about 1/3 HP. I want to use either a dewalt router or an 800 or 2300 watt water cooled spindle. I hope to use higher speeds in conjunction with cutting fluid to get higher IPM. 100-120 IPM would be epic.

    Right now I'm torn between the plate maker set up, and an OX CNC The OX is way bigger of course, so I can do more work at once. But I'm concerned the OX won't have the resolution I want, even if I do micro stepping.

    I was thinking about using the plate maker, since it's much higher resolution because it's a lead screw machine. I was thinking about making it a bit bigger than the stock machine, and using two C beams on the Y axis. Ideally my work space would be around 30x24 inches or workable area. I would probably use 4 gantry plates to give it more support since that's so big. I have seem people do that, and it looks nice, I have also seen people use linear rails and a balls screws. I would probably up grate to that, but I don't have a way to cut the plates yet, so buying this machine, I could make the plates I would need for that. I also like that the X and Z axis on the plate maker are fixed, so I can make the side supports as massive as I want. I could probably make some ½ inch thick aluminum side plates. I can also make some of the other plates a lot more substantial also.

    I have also considered the ROVO cnc machine. I can buy the side plates on ebay, and since it's a lead screw machine, I would get the same resolution as the plate maker. I'm just nervous about it, since I haven't seen too many people do the same set-up.


    Does anyone have any opinions?

    Thank you so much for any input!
     
  5. Rick 2.0

    Rick 2.0 OpenBuilds Team
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    @clovenedhoof, look through the latter half of the Ox thread. There are several examples of Ox derivatives being built with the C-Beam drive system. This would give you the best of both worlds, the precision of the C-Beam system with the efficiency of the Ox framing and table layout. Plates for such a system have already been worked out by @Chris Laidlaw. Another reference for this type of design can be found at C-BEAM-GTC | OpenBuilds
     
  6. clovenedhoof

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    I looked through that. It's pretty interesting, One of the things I am most concerned about is the table of the OX sagging in the middle. The build you reference, they seemed to have really beefed up the base of the OX. I'm really hoping to have my work area be as flat as possible. really .0003 over the whole surface would be ideal.
     
  7. Rick 2.0

    Rick 2.0 OpenBuilds Team
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    You can add as many supports as you like beneath the bed to keep it from flexing but it's not likely you will ever achieve that level of tolerance with wood. You can also have the machine plane the surface to achieve level but you will still be dealing with a material which changes with variations in humidity. A suggestion you might look at is a floating head. Depth regulator | OpenBuilds
     
  8. Jimmybuckets

    Jimmybuckets Well-Known
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    I bought the C-Beam Machine so I could use it as a way to upgrade other projects and build new ones. Also the cost of getting up and running was much lower than the OX. Besides that wanted something more compact. Long term goal will be to build a larger router if space allows. Pretty sure you could have two C-Beam machines up and running for close to the cost of one OX. Then you run a staggered production and control you tolerance better since it is a smaller machine.
     
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  9. Charles Roseberry

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    Hi again guys. I received all of my parts today. They look complete, lack of a complete inventory yet. One thing I noticed was lack of wiring of any kind to tie it all together. Was there something I missed or are you all just outsourcing wires and if so, what are you using? Thanks!
     
  10. evilc66

    evilc66 Journeyman
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    Got my kit on Friday, but no time to work on it :(

    Wiring is left up to you. In the instructional videos, Mark showed some of the basics, but some of it is really dependant on what hardware you are using. For the cables for the steppers, I used a 4 conductor 22awg shielded cable. The shielded cable will help reduce any possibilities of missed steps due to outside interference, and will also prevent false triggers of the limit switches. A thing to note with shielded cables is that you only ground one end of the cable (at the controller end is fine). Grounding both ends creates ground loops that you don't want.

    Connecting the cables to the steppers is also up to you. You can solder directly to the wire ends, or connect through terminal strips or connectors. Adding the terminal strips or connectors is great for servicing, but adds an additional point of failure. Personally, I will be soldering.
     
  11. Brandon Raineri

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    Just ordered my kit today!

    Designed in SolidWorks and will be using HSM Express for G-Code generation. I plan on using 3/4" MDF for the spoil board and milling some t-slots into the top for clamping. I also plan on making some plate gussets to cover the extrusion ends and stiffen up the X-Axis.

    Is there a drawing anywhere for the belt reduction mount plate?
     
    #1031 Brandon Raineri, Apr 11, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2016
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  12. Charles Roseberry

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    So Im attempting to set up grbl interface and it will not retain my settings as instructed in the video. Anyone else have this issue or know why it wont keep the settings? I plug in a setting click out of the interface and it reverts back to what was originally there
     
  13. Jimmybuckets

    Jimmybuckets Well-Known
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    When you change the settings in GRBL panel you have to double click them one at a time. Can't change a bunch and then change have to do them one at a time and double click on it.
     
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  14. Charles Roseberry

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    Thanks Got it!
     
  15. Charles Roseberry

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    Success~! I have x,y,z now all hooked up and operable. Since I doubled the platform in size, I mistakenly assumed to Double the Gantry work plate. Mistake one. I will need to remove it and cut it down because Zero would only be about 11 inches fomr the rear of the work surface. Good thing its not difficult.

     
  16. Rick 2.0

    Rick 2.0 OpenBuilds Team
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    Charles, your video didn't exactly show the whole machine but it looks like you need to move the gantry assembly forward. The center of the spindle should be centered on the y-axis beam.
     
  17. GrayUK

    GrayUK Openbuilds Team Elder
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    Charles. It's getting there. Well done. :thumbsup:
    Howabout, you raise your baseboard up about half an inch, with spacers, off of the Y Axis, then you could arrange for the baseboard to travel over the top of the rear Stepper, and thereby get full coverage of your baseboard. You have enough room with your Z axis. Just need to sort out the fixings on the Y axis. The steppers still sound a little unhappy now and again. :rolleyes:
     
  18. Charles Roseberry

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    ok well I cut down my work area to the 12"x12" as the video stated. I can use that for a larger template if needed (and Im sure I will at some point).

    I have spacers now, per the build, but theyre not tall enough to pass the stepper on the Y. That has crossed my mind (adding taller spacers).

    Im a novice of course, but what I think you heard on the steppers is when the Z bottomed out. and the Y did on the back end. I have reset to zero and those limits are clear now by about 1/4 inch in front of both travel limits.

    I did a coupld of cuts today the wrench and Hello World. Worked out fine. Now for a little more time on software and looking for work.

    I was speaking to Tracy about a fourth axis and that would be great at some point, but Ill work with this learning curve first :)
     
    #1038 Charles Roseberry, Apr 17, 2016
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2016
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  19. Charles Roseberry

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    I am approximately 1/16 off on my x and y measurements, I looked at the calibration links and I dont see a clear way to claibrate the machine. If anyone would be so kind as to post a clearer path to calibration, I would be most grateful.
     
  20. Michael Shore

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    Can you post your grbl settings?
     
  21. Charles Roseberry

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    I will have to get to the machine. I use laptop for the machine as well as personal use at the moment, and unplug to bring it in the house:)
    grbl-sett.jpg
     
  22. Jimmybuckets

    Jimmybuckets Well-Known
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    Are you measuring cuts or just movements? If your steps per mm are off your error would get worse over longer distances. If you are seeing this on cuts you are prob cutting too heavy and or not using conventional cutting. If you are running climb cutting it will produce more deflection.
     
  23. Charles Roseberry

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    I am using grbl panel out of the box so to speak. I have made no adjustments. I loaded a 2"x2" square sample and both internal cuts are short by the 1`/16th of an inch. As far as cutting too heavy, I was cutting 1/8 ply probably birch. Tried same cut on foam, same problem.

    Ill run some more tests.
     
  24. Jimmybuckets

    Jimmybuckets Well-Known
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    Have if you are using the stock steppers than your 200 steps per mm are correct. Have you measured your bit?
     
  25. Charles Roseberry

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    Bit is 1/4 inch.
     
  26. Michael Shore

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    I am having to make some assumptions,

    • 200 steps per mm, I assume you have no micro stepping on the stepper drivers -OOOps I make it 8 microsteps.
    • what ever generated the G-Code was told the bit size, and the correct bit was in the spindle
    so if you cutting a 2" square the bit will actually move 2" + the bit size, if the G-Code is hand generated, did you add this extra bit size?

    Remember the x/y position is the dead centre of the bit and not the edge.

    Not sure if I am making myself clear enough.

    Michael
     
  27. Steve Fox

    Steve Fox Well-Known
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    Measure the width of the cut.
    If it is off, you can adjust the actual bit width.
    It could be off because the bit is wider than advertised and/or the router collet has runout.
    Some of mine are off, but none are off by 1/16". It's just something to check.
     
  28. Charles Roseberry

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    understood, thanks guys will check these parameters ere in a second.
     
  29. Michael Shore

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    and maybe mark the starting position on the X C-Beam then move 2" and mark it again, measure the movement, is it off by 1/16? are any of the leadscrew lock collars moving if you try and move the spindle left/right.

    if you move 2" in one direction and then 2" back, does it end up in the same location or is it off? possibly backlash somewhere.

    Michael
     
  30. Charles Roseberry

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    ok considering what you have stated, I measured the 2" square again, and it is off 1/16th internally on both x and y, assuming that was stated, it should theoretically be 1/16th too large not too small. This is not the case. In any event Im stioll looking at it.
     

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