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Blackbox VFD question ***Solved: Added howto guide***

Discussion in 'Controller Boards' started by OberSchutze, Jul 26, 2019.

  1. OberSchutze

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    Hello, do you have a wire diagram from the black box to a huanyang vfd. I cannot find a diagram to match the output. Also the 0-10v line does go to 5v when I select half speed for testing voltage, it seems to either be at full 10v or 0v.

    EDIT: OpenBuilds BlackBox to HuanYang VFD Configuration

    Howto guide for ease of access.
     
    #1 OberSchutze, Jul 26, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2019
    sergiomajluf and Jonrichspriggs like this.
  2. OberSchutze

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    Attached a picture of my wiring.
     

    Attached Files:

  3. sharmstr

    sharmstr Master
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  4. OberSchutze

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    Right I set m3 s12000 and it still goes to 24000, then when I set m5 it idles at 6000 instead of turning off.
     
  5. OberSchutze

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    Bit of an update. I got the speed portion to work correctly now, removed the relay function jumper on the BB. Only issue I have now is when I type m5 it doesn't turn off the spindle. The 0-10v signal goes to 0 but the spindle still idles at 6k rpm.
     
  6. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    Sounds like VFD parameters?
     
  7. OberSchutze

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    I added a estop switch between DCM and FOR to reset it. Am I able to use that relay to do the same thing?
     
  8. OberSchutze

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    It is a klugy solution but I put the jumper on the coolant setting and use m8 to turn the DCM to FOR connection closed. Then use m3 sxxxx for speed. The m5 relay disengage doesn't work.
     
  9. OberSchutze

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    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  10. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    Beautiful! I'll use your information for a writeup on docs.openbuilds.com soon!

    I have on enhancement for you try though: We CAN get rid of M8 (;
    (I'll try and get it prebuilt into the Flashing tool soon! just posting early if you wanted to play with it)

    1) If you define #define USE_SPINDLE_DIR_AS_ENABLE_PIN gnea/grbl in Grbl's config it will set the "dir" pin when spindle should activate. But (and good idea for a future revision of BlackBox) Spindle Dir is on the toolhead header, but not on the Jumpers :)
    But we can just redefine the pins:

    2) Change gnea/grbl and gnea/grbl and interchange with gnea/grbl (ie change it so Coolant is using D13 and Spindle Enable is using A3 (which is on the Jumper as M8/M9)

    3) Recompile and flash

    When I get time, i'll add an option to our Built in Firmware Flashing tool (under Tools and Wizard) to swop it for users.
    And in an upcoming revision of BlackBox we might consider adding an extra jumper position for this too

    That should trigger the relay whenever M3 S>0 is active :)


     
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  11. OberSchutze

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    Would it be possible in a future revision to add a couple of more jumpers to allow full digital control of a HY style VFD though the tookhead header, it's a standard serial connection and the HY and clones VFD are the most popular vfd option.
     
  12. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    We are limited by what Grbl can do. Pwm only, no Modbus :)
     
  13. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    Hi @OberSchutze, fellow forum user @JacobE1988 got his VFD to run without a relay on DCM/FOR - jumpered permanently and only stopping by setting the 10v input to 0v.
    See BlackBox

    Now for a while I suspected maybe different inverters, some just dont stop unless you also cut FOR, but thinking about his success again, I am wondering if its not a VFD setting.
    Maybe you two want to compare a little, if we can figure out which setting, you can get your Relay/Cooling outputs back (;
     
  14. JacobE1988

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    I followed parts of your write-up when getting my going. But in my opinion you're missing some pretty important information dealing with settings within the VFD. I'll be doing a write-up as well so we can then compare notes more effectively. But as of now I don't need to use a relay to engage/disengage the spindle. As @petervanderwalt stated, it opens the COOL/RELAY back up for use for other accessories.
     
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  15. Stumpy

    Stumpy New
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    Peter, read all of the above and thought I understood what I needed to do to get my VFD up and running. My question is are there any "new and different" versions out that I might not have? I have version 1.0.192.
     
  16. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    Nope, 1.0.192 is the current version, if ever in doubt, see OpenBuilds/OpenBuilds-CONTROL
     
  17. OberSchutze

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    Keep in mind there are a few Chinese VFD boxes out there and some changes may be needed.
     
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  18. Stumpy

    Stumpy New
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    Thank you, sir. As ever, a gentleman and a scholar!
     
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  19. MikeTheMaker

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    Hi Jacob,

    Have you made any progress on your write-up? Very interested in reading it as I'm trying to get my wiring and controls set up on my build now and finding lots of contradicting information as well as missing info as you mentioned. Thanks!!
     
  20. JacobE1988

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    I'm sorry I have not. I've been designing a dust boot and trying to get it into production so my time has been taken up.
     
  21. LARRY RADCLIFFE

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    I followed the write up that OberSchutze put together using the black box, I got the spindle to come on I am new to the CNC world so forgive me but the command to "turn on the spindleM3" is activated by the "coolant M8" for my VFD setup is that the only way to trigger the spindle? I also have the water cooled spindleand I would like to trigger the pump as well once it turns on?

    This next question may be for another forum but I have double checekd my parameters on the VFD and I can onlyget it to spin up to 12k RPM my frequencies have all been adjusted to the 400 HZ setting where they need to be but still only spins at 12K?

    Thank you
     
  22. Randy Catlette

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    Hello all, New guy here, didn't know if this was a good place to post this or if I should have created a new thread. But my question, is there any diagrams to hook up a SuperPID to the black box when you utilize a IOT for the on / off control, or would it just be as easy to wire the everything through the PID. Im running a DW660 on a small setup, the IOT works awesome with the BlackBox, but like to add a good way to control my tool. Ant help would be appreciated, thanks.
     
  23. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    There isnt a diagram at this time

    But some comments:
    With a SuperPID, you won't be using the IOT relay as well. The SuperPID will turn the router on/off and do the speed control.
    Wiring instructions are available from SuperPID themselves, the PWM+GND signal off the toolhead header on the BlackBox is used to get PWM to the SuperPID (Just like every other Grbl controller)
     
  24. Randy Catlette

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    Thank you sir, that is what I was guessing, the IOT will still be useful for my Vac system, thank you for such a quick reply and have a happy holiday.
     
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  25. Robin Crorie

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    Hey @Peter Van Der Walt! So my BlackBox has the new jumpers for the VFD/Dir to relay so that I can use this to enable the "Run" state in the VFD. However I noticed that there is no option in the CONTROL software to enable the
    USE_SPINDLE_DIR_AS_ENABLE_PIN option in grbl's config.h.

    Not a problem, I can enable this myself and flash the BlackBox. But before I do, I wanted to check if there was anything in the config.h I NEED to change before flashing? I have grabbed the latest grbl 1.1 from their github. I can comfortably read through the config file in grbl for desired changes, but is there anything out of the ordinary that needs to be set for CONTROL to still co-operate at all?

    I see you have a number of pre-compiled .hex files bundled inside the Electron app and I am wondering if there are any other options that you have changed apart from the obvious differences in their file names.

    I am actually an experienced Electron dev, so I am going to add my compiled grbl hex to the options in grbl-flashing.js too so that I can easily flash this if needed in future straight from CONTROL. If this is something of interest I am happy to PR it for you to look at in GitHub - just let me know.
     
    #25 Robin Crorie, Jun 7, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2020
  26. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    We are busy with documentation updates to some of the newer board and firmware features. Need documentation in place before we add the option to Flash tool. Else users will flash without understanding

    We run stock grbl, so just that one setting.

    We do also set $4=1 and $1=255 by default so users doesnt have to remember to do that
     
  27. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
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    Refer OpenBuilds/control-grbl-buildall
     
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  28. Robin Crorie

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    Amazing! Yes I 100% assumed it was something in-the-works as I couldn't find anything relating to the new jumper. However even though I am ahead of the curve slightly I am eager to make use of this new feature for my new build.

    Keep up the awesome work, you guys really rock. I appreciate that quick response too!!
     
  29. Ebon eben

    Ebon eben New
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    hello
    I have followed this, i have completed the wire from the BB to the VFD ACM (g) V1 (10V). placed a jump cable between the DCM/FOR. Check and have 10v but still can not turn the spndle on with the BB. BB lights up as to say its got the tool head on but no go at the VFD or spindle (air cooled no water) have also move the jumper on the vfd to V1 from VR still nothing. am I missing something?

    only runnig two wires from the tool head plug nothing from the relay plug

    thank you
     
  30. OberSchutze

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    Can you post a picture of your wiring, there are also settings inside the VFD that need to be set.
     

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