Welcome to Our Community

Some features disabled for guests. Register Today.

BlackBox

Discussion in 'Other Builds' started by Mark Carew, Feb 22, 2019.

  1. Michael Forte

    Builder

    Joined:
    May 15, 2015
    Messages:
    16
    Likes Received:
    10
    Hi,
    I'm looking at upgrading the Smoothieboard 5XC on my OX to an OpenBuilds Blackbox controller due to the simplicity of the Blackbox design. However, I want to have it run my CNC spindle in addition to a laser (JTech 2.8W). Of course, only one would be used at a time. Is there a way to do this?
    Thanks for any help!
     
  2. Neil Scott

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    14
    yes please, im new to cnc and could do with it!nTx....
     
  3. Neil Scott

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    14
  4. Neil Scott

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    14
    Hello, I hope this is the right place to post this question, I'm new to this size of CNC and have just purchased my kit for a lead 1075 from MakerSupplied in Denmark, I'm based in Spain but English, I have just spent the last two evenings going though all 19 pages of the posts on the Blackbox, My system is due to come with one.

    One thing that I have noticed is that a lot of the photographs on here that show the black box , show it adjacent to the Gantry or near it, once of the things I was going to do was have a dedicated electronics PSU ventilated control box bolted to the wall rather than have any electronics mounted or near the Gantry.

    Is there any reason not to do this? I was planning on using avionics plugs to run the cabling from the Gantry up into the box and then solder the black box leads directly onto the back of the avionics plugs. Basically every lead that goes to the gantry would have this. Steppers, Limits, Probe, Power, Mill, Laser.

    I understand that the board itself does not support an Estop for obvious reasons as its all low voltage and E stops and normally on Mains , some people have made a temporary E stop using the "open cabinet" circuitry it would seem as well.

    I come from Laser land and I am used to a rotational axis for working on glass bottles and round stock, now I have two powerful diode lasers so was planning to allow for one of these to be used on the 1075 as well, For the rotational axis we normally just pull the "Y" axis and plug the rotary unit into that, Any reasons why I should not continues to do that please.

    The controllers we use are all GRBL anyway and I normally use UGS or Lightburn.

    Just a few questions please if people wouldn't mind making any comments that would be great as my build is arriving shorlty and I want to start right straight from the start.

    It sound like to me never having used anything other than GRBL that this new Black Box is a suped up much more powerful version of our standard grbl controllers with extras like relays etc. They all have limit switches already and I have spindle control on my small cnc.

    The plug in socket relay extension that you sell , is that available in a european version please for dust control, lighting, Smoke evacuation and and so on?

    Thank you for reading and getting very excited on the delivery of my entire kit next week, Many thanks, Neil Scott, Sitges Spain.
     
  5. Matthew Hindes

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2019
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Is there a way to use all 4 axis and not set Y2 as a slave?
     
  6. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    That is a cheapie CUT40 but if you haven't bought a plasma yet, get a Blowback Start unit. HF start systems can be mader to work, but expect to spend a couple hours sorting our EMI issues! :)
     
  7. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    Absolutely! You can mount it whereever you want


    Or stay in the Xtensions Standard Xtension Wire Set - 4 Conductor and Xtension Wire Set - 3 Conductor


    Still applies! Axes Wrapping is awesome
     
    Neil Scott likes this.
  8. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    Grbl is a 3 Axes only firmware. The 4th driver can only be slaved to one of the 3 cartesian axes
     
  9. Neil Scott

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    14
    Thanks I have the CUT 50 amp model but its now more or less the same footprint as the 40 I didnt realise the cnc would hold a torch until I saw that post, It works very well but I guess there's going to be damage to the wheels and gantry though from the sparks etc.... Its was great to see it work.

    I freehand cut a lot of lizards out of sheet steel here in spain, then age them and sell them on as wall decor for the villas here or lights, biggest i did was 3 metres long.....dress them up with a bit of brazing to give them the spots on their back, would be nice not to get burnt as much but the first machine is going to do wood and ali !!

    Can you get away with lighter rails than the leadscrew or workbee for the plasma or do you need the same profiles....
     
  10. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    I
    I prefer a solid machine - just always better to avoid having issues with sagging, or deflections under acceleration, etc. Belts are a little better for plasma (high feedrate) than leadscrew.
    With the CUT40/50 its super simple, see OpenBuilds BlackBox 4X Documentation for wiring
    The HF start puts out some EMI, but a couple ferrite cores around all wiring, and spacing the inverter and tip away from control electronics, gets you there most of the time. There are some other online hacks like putting a gnd wire directly to the tip to act as built in pilot arc, that you can checkout too, that cuts away a lot of EMI as the spark length is so much shorter - havent tried (or needed to) myself:
    For example Adrian's: (Bad quality videos but quite a knowledgable guy)
     
    Neil Scott likes this.
  11. Neil Scott

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    14
    tx ill take a look,
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  12. devloop

    devloop Well-Known
    Builder

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
    Messages:
    61
    Likes Received:
    86
    Will this grbl post processor work for a plasma table as well? States router in post
     
  13. David the swarfer

    David the swarfer OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2013
    Messages:
    3,237
    Likes Received:
    1,815
    probably a good starting point. plasma usually needs more setup codes for torch height control and so on. the post is easy to modify to do what you need, it is just Java.
    if you cannot do the programming then if you can tell us exactly what is needed, and provide an example Fusion file, an example of the gcode , and an example of the gocde modified to work with the plasma then one of us here can modify the post to do what you need.
     
  14. devloop

    devloop Well-Known
    Builder

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
    Messages:
    61
    Likes Received:
    86
    That would be great, I have X & Y only, no Z, work in Imperial, nothing fancy, turn the torch on and off when required, thanks
     
  15. GeneLV

    GeneLV New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2018
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    6
    While surfacing my new spoilboard my cnc stopped a couple of times about halfway through (motion and spindle) with no error messages displayed and I was unable to move any axis until I unplugged the USB from to the Blackbox. After I was finally able to get the spoilboard sufaced I started on my grid lines and about 90% through it again stopped but this time all of my setting in the Blackbox were set to factory defaults. Glitch? Blackbox going out? Any ideas?
     
  16. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    Loosing settings points to a brown-out condition (undervoltage)
    So I would check, in order:
    - Limit switch wiring, cross checked against docs.openbuilds.com (incorrect wiring can short 5v rail to GND)
    - Power Supply
    - EMI
     
  17. GeneLV

    GeneLV New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2018
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    6
    Thanks for the reply Peter. I swapped out my z-axis on my workbee for the CNC4NEWBIE Z so I'll double check the wiring on the Z limit.
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  18. kbaaab

    kbaaab New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    1
    Hi Guys

    Is there no PDF of the complete Blackbox 4x documentation that I can download? I see the html tree driven stuff, but this is impossible to print without going into each and every link to do so ... a single complete PDF of this would be soooooo much easier to deal with...

    Thanks in advance...
     
  19. Neil Scott

    Builder

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2019
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    14
    I couldn't find one but i didn't dig too deep
     
  20. kbaaab

    kbaaab New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    1
    Sigh... I know... I have looked and tried... really frustrating way of displaying the documentation, a script generated menu that is unable to provide a concise printable complete document...

    oh well...
     
  21. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    PDFs make it harder for us to support you, in no time theres old outdated PDFs floating around instead of users getting continuously updated, valid, and corrected information. Online documentation ensures its always up to date. Its mobile friendly, just keep your phone/tablet nearby :)
     
    sharmstr likes this.
  22. kbaaab

    kbaaab New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2020
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ok... if you say so ...

    Don't know why you do not have the option to print the entire document in a single go though... this current way sucks. Give the user the option rather than not have it at all.

    Oh well... add to the frustration then, here I go to do each page individually... seems like a cop out actually...
     
    Peter Van Der Walt likes this.
  23. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    While you are at it, also see gnea/grbl = if you insist on printed copies print out each of those pages on the right too for some bedtime reading.
    Of course accessing all this content digitally would have been better (searchable, bookmarkable, up to date (2 updates just today already for example Limit switch documentation fault?) ) but oh well :) good luck
     
    #563 Peter Van Der Walt, Jan 8, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2020
  24. Brandon Hurst

    Builder

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2015
    Messages:
    21
    Likes Received:
    4
    Is the ghost case giveaway over?
     
  25. estolt

    estolt New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2016
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    1
    Peter, i finally bought the black box and have it up and running. i'm going to wire up the hall effect sensors, can the blackbox handle 2 sensors on each axis? would i wire them in series? thank you
     
  26. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    Not tooo sure whether it should be serial or parallel: but i can't think how you would even begin to wire a powered sensor in series, so I'd guess parallel. Not sure it they would affect each other. Throw some trial and error at it, the Troubleshooting tab in CONTROL can be used to see if they work
     
  27. estolt

    estolt New
    Builder

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2016
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    1
    thank you, i will post what i come up with.
     
  28. stuart wallace

    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2019
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    6
    Is it possible to use the open builds iot thing for the router with blackbox and use the jtech laser with blackbox at the same time? Or when I want to use the laser, do I need to unplug the iot connection to the blackbox so I can plug in the laser to the blackbox? Looks like they use the same ports.
     
  29. Peter Van Der Walt

    Peter Van Der Walt OpenBuilds Team
    Staff Member Moderator Builder Resident Builder

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    13,749
    Likes Received:
    4,070
    Correct, they use the same port

    - unplug is one option
    - or add a double throw switch to swop the PWM/Spindle signal between relevant device: See docs:blackbox:iot-and-laser [OpenBuilds Documentation]
    - or wire it to both permanently, but only switch on the relevant peripheral (for example if the laser doesnt have power, it will blissfully ignore the PWM signal)
    - Keep in mind you have to change Grbl Setting: $32 - Laser Mode between swops too
     
    #569 Peter Van Der Walt, Jan 21, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2021
    Rick 2.0 likes this.
  30. stuart wallace

    Builder

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2019
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    6

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice